Perhaps you’re becoming an agnostic like myself. Since I grew up here, I never caught on to Hindusim, even though my parents tried their best to teach me. :huh:

Guess, you are more agnostic than atheistic. You could fall into the latter cateogry if you deny the presence of God!. But since you just skeptical about it, agnostic might be the better expression.

I guess so, Niraj and Raj - I am neither interested in denying or proving the existence of anything, so agnostic might be a better term for it.

Come to the dark side, Luke…

Join me and I will complete your training.

:tongue3:

LOL, MadMan - I am almost there…

Curious, Shanti….You seem to have been a Hindu, and are now an agnostic, for no ‘reasons’ per se: At least, you don’t discuss them in your post.

I take it that your newfound skepticism isn’t a global one, since that position is literally incoherent.

Like Niraj, I was brought up here but—unlike him—Hinduism has caught me ;)

Anonymous Kashmiri Pandit
P.S. you only really on yourself and no one else ? Really ? Perhaps you’re a true jivanmukta ;)

I dunno if you have read “The Life of Pi” but a nice statement somewhat on the lines of an atheist doesn’t believe in God but an agnostic doesn’t believe in faith…great difference there. I think it does give your life an added advantage if you do look up to something

Way to go, Shanti! Who was that who said, “True self-discovery begins with confusion?” Since you are on the subject of Hindusim, a particular school of thought (don’t remember which) says that persistent questioning leads to truth. I believe you are on that path.

All the best and take good care of yourself and the Little One!

We in the atheist camp are waiting for you. Fir sab log nark ki bus pakdenge. LOL :mad:

On a serious note, I started off like you, believing in God as a child and all. Somewhere in my teen, when i started thinking logically and questioning religion, I realised there were major holes in the issue. For a few years I believed myself to be an agnostic, but then, around 6 years back or so, I realised that I was an atheist. Period.

Though my dad and grandparents are very religious, they never forced anything down my throat. Even now, they are comfortable being pious, and they are comfortable with my atheism.

My mom is a slightly different case though. She used to be an almost-agnostic for many years, but the same time that I became an atheist, she became a believer. So she still tries to talk me into praying and all, though she is very mild about it.

I guess new converts are more enthu, wot?

AKP, I am right now what Patrix describes as an agnostic - it is faith I don’t believe in right now, while I have no opinion on God…yet. I think what led to this questioning and skepticism is the fact that when I was growing up, there wasn’t much questioning of faith in the household. Everything was a given and we had to be a certain way since that is how it has always been done. I felt comfortable going with the flow - now that I don’t have to, I can question anything and everything freely :)

Sandeep, thanks for the good wishes - have you read any Jiddu Krishnamurthi?

Gaurav, I agree that new converts have more fervor than people who have been in something just because they have been so always :) Unfortunately, my mom is really into religion and she and my mom-in-law would be shocked to the core if I announced to them I was not interested their faith and rituals right now.

From your description it just looks like you have lost interest in rituals and nothing more.

Very possible, JK - which is why I haven’t labeled myself yet. It is a pretty tricky situation and I have no idea where it all is going to end up.

Odd, I seem to become more religious, not less, as times goes by.

yeah, but Shanti..i can understand you not believing in God but disbelief in faith is something strange…faith need not be religious

Patrix, I know how crazy that sounds, but for some reason, I just cannot accept anything right now that I am supposed to believe in just because. The acceptance of conventional wisdom or tradition, whatever one might call it, is something I cannot do anymore. All I knew in India was faith, a lot more than God and Godliness. My mom probably believes in the Gita a lot more than she does in Krishna. I guess that is what brings up the strange dichotomy in my belief system.

Shanti, I understand ur disbelief in any kind of belief and like another person said, skepticism is the beginning to belief.. only when u question, u will get answers. But, from ur child’s perspective, I think not believing in anything might make the child ending up insecure. I remember reading in a book or article that kids must be taught to trust people/things. Otherwise, they will not get the amount of security you need for a child. U r able to think clearly on your own now, bcos u were thought in ur young age, the difference betn right and wrong. i think ur child should be given that opportunity too.

Those are some nice suggestions, Priya - I think as far my kid is concerned, there are some things that are unquestionably true, like lying is wrong, stealing is wrong, being kind is good, etc. and I am definitely going to teach him that. Only when it comes to religion and spirituality that I am not going to push him in any direction, but will be there ready to explore different things with him and help him along his path.

I find it interesting that most of you guys (who I assume resided in India until the end of high school/university and then moved to the States) are only now moving gradually towards atheism…

While I am someone who was only in India for 6 months after being born, then spent all my formative years in north america… went through high school as a highly agnostic post-modern liberal… but now as a working adult, feel a strong pull towards spirituality and socially moderate Conservatism. I can’t rightly claim to be agnostic anymore, but strangely I find myself more critical of Hinduism (as well as all other organized religions) while I also find myself having a greater belief in some sort of God-like figure.

Weird…

MD: “Odd, I seem to become more religious, not less, as times goes by”

Yeah, I feel the same way. But I don’t exactly have a stronger belief in Hanuman or Ganesh or the umpteenth avatar of Vishnu or anything… rather, the opposite.

The thing is, if someone asked me to label myself, I’d reply “Hindu”. Even worse, I’d want to educate my kid (if I ever have one) on his Brahminical heritage.

Am I a hypocrite?

JR, I don’t think your situation can be labeled hypocritical as long as you are still looking honestly for an answer. I do understand your need to lay a foundation of your heritage in your child, before he can grow up enough to explore religion and spirituality on his own.

I tried to not respond but I was quite unsuccessful, as you can see from the long post below [do forgive me ;) ]….

First, like JR, I came to the U.S. when quite young but unlike him I am quite strongly drawn to Hindu dharma. That said….

It’s curious that so many people—here, JR and Shanti—draw a distinction between ‘spirituality’ and
‘[organized] religion’. For example, Shanti wrote that her mother may well believe in the BG more than Krishna (or words to that effect).

But, Shanti, your mother is right: She should ‘believe’ in the BG more than Krishna. After all, how else would she know about Krishna? Krishna, for Vaishnavas, is God but he certainly isn’t the God of the philosphers or even of those who hanker after spirituality—not an original observation, but still valid.

The BG , for those who take it seriously [as your mom does, I take it], is a ‘pramana’ which allows us to know Krishna. As such, yeah your mom’s attitude to the BG/Krishna is definitely very classical—and I mean that as a compliment!

And that brings me to JR’s post: I’ve never thought that being a good Hindu necessarily entails an especially zealous devotion to Vishnu or Ganesh. The worship of a particular deity, while important, isn’t the highest good one can pursue (unless one happens to be a sectarian theist).

As a good brahmin [shock! horror! ;) ], I’ve always thought that svadyhaya was key: study and recitation of the sruti and smriti. And by study I mean, of course, listen, reflect and discuss.

JR, I do hope you carry through with your plan to teach your future child/children about Dharma. It isn’t hypocrisy: Teaching your child nothing doesn’t mean he/she is likely to be a blank slate. The child will likely pick up some other faith—and here I define faith broadly to include all varieties of theism/atheism/agnosticism. [ Even the Pyrrohnists acknowledged that they had an [unjustifiable] belief
that bread nourishes and water slakes thirst !]

AKP, there is absolutely nothing wrong with responding to posts that echo your interests - please feel free :) The more that join the discussion, the more interesting and diverse it gets.

Anon etc. Pandit,

The child will likely pick up some other faith—and here I define faith broadly to include all varieties of theism/atheism/agnosticism.

Atheism is emphatically NOT faith-based. It’s religion that calls for faith.

We atheists don’t believe in anything. How can a lack of belief involve faith?

MadMan, not to put too fine a point on it, atheism isn’t merely a lack of belief in some state of affairs ‘X’—that characterization is more appropriate for agnositicism.

I take atheism (broadly conceived) to be an assertion—unsupported by the balance of evidence at hand—that there are no immaterial agents at work in this universe. Given this lack of evidence in its favor, atheism does indeed amount to an assertion of faith/belief.

Belief in a theory which isn’t supported over other theories by the evidence at hand is a good demarcation criterion in my opinion—notice, btw, that I’m not arguing that there is no evidence for atheism. All I’m arguing—all I need to show—is that atheism as well as its rivals are equally well-supported by the evidence. And my conclusion that atheism and its rivals are all a species of faith follows.